THE WOLF'S DEN - Tana dei Lupi II

[maro]

Keep trying to auto-felate, Davit. It's likely to happen sooner.

[DavidP]

i'm trying to have a serious discussion here, fatso

[DCGweez]

I applaud your Loyalty to the Roman/Italians but I fear youve picked the wrong club. Atletico Bilbao may be the right fit.

I like the intentions but I fear consequence. Be satisfied with one of those guys being up to Starting full time. If 2 can and we are competitive thank your lucky stars.

[Lupa]

I think Gerrard is over-rated, and perhaps Fabregas is too, but not as much, at least by the English media. Fabregas is a more interesting player, to me.

[Lupa]

[red]

[DavidP]

[DCGweez]

Davit,

We need your enthusiasm and idealism to counteract our old man negativity and pessimism. Keep it up

[AS Collie]

No, not at all! I'm still trying to make it out.

I understand your point about the wage structure, but I think that there are several top class players in the bundesliga or playing at sides like Arse, ie at places with sensible wages. Given the fact we primarily need a CB, I can't see a top-class defender's wages being an issue. How much were we blowing a week on bloody Cicinho? I didn't mean to imply that we go after someone currently at the likes of Real, just that signing a top class player with the kind of ability that would make it difficult/impossible to get him on the cheap.

PS: for the record, I've been an Alonso admirer since he broke out at Sociedad. It's not always a pissing contest you know!

[maro]

Of course it's not a contest - I'm winning by miles. Actually, I was just trying to make the point Lupa made - that I'm quite happy to agree on the quality of those three. I thought it was quite amusing two and four years ago that most of the English press were outraged that Fabregas wasn't starting for Spain (Senna, of course, also being ahead of him in 2008). They've just about come round to the idea that Silva and Iniesta and Xavi and Alonso aren't bad players and so that Fabgregas's being behind them wasn't quite the miscalculation it was thought to be.

Of course Gerrard is a very fine player; I've just long thought that he doesn't have the tactical discipline (has refused to show it, I suspect) to play as an out-and-out central midfielder and, equally, doesn't have the technique to play as a true attacking midfielder. Certainly that's what Benitez's struggles to find him a position in the 4-2-3-1 seemed to suggest and while he scored a lot of goals in behind the striker in the Premiershit, every time he came up against a good team he got suffocated out of the game because he couldn't play as a true trequartista in tight spaces. Fabregas is better in both regards, I believe, but Gerrard also has enormous ticker, for which I give him a lot of credit.

[DCGweez]

I think Cesc has great technical quality. I just don't find him to be particularly impactfull. I bag on all my Manure friends who took to calling Rooney the "White Pele" a few years ago, when Rooney can barely string 3 dribbles together. That said he has a knack to pop and be impactfull.

I'd much rather Roma players emulate a player like Rooney who punches above his weight skill wise than someone who has all the tools but rarely steps up.

After all, if it's just about skill then I suggest we take a look at this PSG player, his name is Jeremy something.

[maro]

I'd be surprised if there are too many Arsewipe fans, having seen Fabregas carry the side for several seasons, who'd agree that he doesn't 'step up' or 'punch above his weight'.

[DCGweez]

Carry them where?

To third and a CL spot? Not likely to see them in Europe till they find someone to replace him I suppose.

Although in fairness his inclusion in the Barca side has seem them change league position.

[maro]

As far and further than the side could reasonably have expected to go in Premiershite and Champignons League alike.

[DCGweez]

The evidence, while anecdotal, suggests he had little impact on their league position. Last year they slipped what? 1 place and I would a case would be made City probably would have surpassed them with Fabs and that with a disastrous transfer campaign.

This year are we to suppose they would have challenged the Mancs for second or first (Noting their kitty would have been smaller without his sale)

The disease is asymptomatic. Meet the new Arsenal. Same as the old Arsenal.

[maro]

That depends on what you mean by "evidence," I should think. From what I saw, Van Persie carried Arsenal this year in the way Fabregas has in the past - and the fact that Van Persie for once managed to get through the season without missing big stretches of it through injury compensated a bit for Fabregas's loss. It only makes me wonder where Arsenal would have been had Van Persie had his usual injury troubles - and where they might have been had he managed to steer clear of injury last season or the season before . . . .

[DCGweez]

I suppose it does. But better anecdotal than extrapolative I always say. (Never said that before)

I still think he's the best 4th guy picked for Club and 5 th for country in the MF alone.

[maro]

As a Platonist, I could hardly disagree more.

[DCGweez]

I prefer my philosophers more brooding and less didactic.

[maro]

Midwifery rather than didacticism, I think.