AC Milan general spiel 2.0

[The MAN]

[maro]

1. Sorry, Bilan is here to stay; it's a term of affection in its own way - like Sphincter and Rubentus.

2. "Irrespective of the fact that this is a totally unnecessary signing by Real (like red mentioned, RB2 or CB would've made a little more sense) but I still don't know how you can justify spending 30 million on a fullback who's relatively untested at the big stage."

If you can justify the money spent on Ibra I don't see how it's much of a stretch to justify the money spent on Cointreau.

3. "By the way, your definition of "proven on the International stage and in European football " vastly differs from mine. 52 games for Benfica over 4 years (with loans to lower divisions) and 15 for Portugal...if this is "proven" then 3/4 of Europe is."

Not much of that 3/4 of Europe has played with such accomplishment and confidence at a World Cup - on the International stage, I think most would consider those performances alone no little proof. And then it's just a question of how highly you would rate Benfica's achievements in Europe over the past couple of seasons. I gather he has been an important part of that team's success.

4. "We have our share if bad investments, as all clubs do, but nowhere close to the magnitude of Real, Chelski or Man Shitty, who spend in 1 year whats others do in 5. If you think others splash their money and inflate the market like these clubs do, there's nothing I can do to change your mind..."

I quite accept that Real and Shitty and Chelski inflate transfer prices another step beyond the level Bilan inflate them; that another set of clubs, conspicuous among which sits Bilan, inflate them, in their turn, is pretty self-evident. I think it's kind of funny how some Bilanisti like to figure the inflation their club propagates as somehow within the natural limits of the game, defensible, justifiable, even 'natural', drawing the line there, though, so that anything beyond that level is somehow an egregious violation of sporting decency.

[arthurfonzarelli]

[The MAN]

[p_maldini_3]

while i do think contrao is too expensive AND a seemingly vain purchase, i remember thinking the same thing of dany alves when barca bought him a few years ago. and he has been worth every penny. i hate the motherfucker, but he is, hands down, one of barca's best players.

and the rising prices of quality fullbacks just go to show the importance they are getting in today's game. fullbacks are definitely the most important part of a properly functioning football team today.

[maro]

Aye, mk, it certainly does show the importance of the fullback. Fullbacks are funny breeds - unbelievably important for the balance of a team while at the same time individually totally reliant on the team's mechanism for the value of their individual contribution. It's a curious dialectic which makes it desperately hard to assess the value of any particular fullback.

Agreed, of course, Fonz. TheMan, the point, I think, is simply that the clarity with which you see the line distinguishing Real's unnecessary and irresponsible spending from BIlan's responsible spending is spurious, though you cling to it as though it were ethically valid and important. It's as spurious as trying to defend Roma's spending as exactly the right amount, ethically, to preserve the values and principles of the game would be. Any more is excess; any less is a function of a smaller club operating at a lower level - this, it seems to me, is pretty clearly a nonsense.

[The MAN]

You spend based on what you make and live within your means. Maybe you view that as 'nonsense' but it's a fair principle to me. It doesn't happen in reality that way but this is what ideally it should be and maybe FFP, maybe in a somewhat flawed way, would try to address... unless you happen to think a North American style salary cap (hard or soft or whatever) is actually applicable to European football in which everybody pays the same. I actually do follow the financial info of football clubs whenever available. Of the three teams that are inflating the market, I accept that as Real's roughly double that of Milan, then that would naturally mean they would have the advantage of spending more (how much more depends on several factors). But also, last time I checked, their debt amounts to almost 250 million while Milan's is not even remotely close. Barca's is about 400 million. I would hope sooner or later this catches up to them. Chelski and Man Shitty have their sugar daddies. I'm not defending other big European clubs like Milan, Manure, Bayern etc are ethical or whatever terms you want to throw, each club will make a splash or two at some point as these are still powerful teams, but that Real-Chelski-Shitty axis is consistently spending at a ridiculous rates so it's not wrong to question that since this does end up having a ripple effect on the rest of the market.

[vtec]

it's one thing for an interista to call us bilan given that his team has never been relegated to serie b, but for a romanista to do it is way beyond the border of the ridiculous given that your team has spent more time in the basement. it's almost as ridiculous as a romanista making fun of our finances, given that roma can't even pay their players on time. that pretty much makes your team the most financially irresponsible in italy, ahead of even inter, who at least have moratti's strong personal assets to back the spending.

[DavidP]

wrong. bologna.

[romawi]

[DavidP]

lol. +1

[maro]

Sure, TheMan, that distinction makes lots of sense. To use it to distinguish Bilan from Real, however, seems to me improbable - unless you sincerely believe Berlusconi's Bilan have been living within their means, balancing the books, all these years. And then in practice it's hard to sustain because of the ability of some clubs to inject extraordinary additional money to 'rebalance' the books, as it were (so Abramovich dipping into his personal pockets or Real doing that extraordinary deal with the sale of their stadium). It's almost impossible to legislate against that since there are clearly so many different kinds of ways clubs can find to generate 'revenue'. The deal Real did with their stadium was quite extraordinary, but then many might argue so were the tv deals Bilan, Rube, and Sphincter were living off for so many years.

'tec, those two points fall so far below your own usual standards I feel a little embarrassed for you.

[vtec]

lol, i had the same sentiment about your posts here, but you've been progressively lowering that bar of expectations for a long while now. why don't you give dp another lecture in the shoutbox about how immature and unbefitting a true fan it is to make fun of other teams?

[maro]

sorry. did i get under your skin? i didn't mean to. i thought you took a little more pride in your craft. besides, i don't lecture; i engage in dialectics. you know this.

[vtec]

that's a sure-tell sign that things are not what they were in your ole noggin'

[DavidP]

[arthurfonzarelli]

[The MAN]

Yes, we cheat about as much as you win, so it's relative indeed.

[arthurfonzarelli]

[RomaShield27]

Good article:

http://forzaitalianfootball.com/2011/07 ... conundrum/